Re: Hot Metal and HTML

pflynn@oclc.org (Peter Flynn)
Date: Tue, 14 Jun 94 05:32:32 EDT
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From: pflynn@oclc.org (Peter Flynn)
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Subject: Re: Hot Metal and HTML
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Tim writes:

> I hear that Hot Metal won't read HTML.

I hadn't heard that.

> In HTML <P> has been defined and used as a separator rather than a container.
> There are many who would have prefered that it had always been a container,
> but there it is: it isn't.

But I think it is: both the current and previous copies of the DTD at
http://info.cern.ch/hypertext/WWW/MarkUp/html.dtd, which most users will 
treat as the canonical reference, say <!ELEMENT P - o (some content)>
which is not the same thing as defining it EMPTY.

It has been acknowledged that defining it as a separator was a simple
mistake, and the best thing is to put that right now, not perpetuate it.

> The essential thing which defines the boundary on changes to the HTML DTD
> is network interoperatbility.  That is a sine qua non.  [...]

Almost. But are we talking browser-level interop (which we already have) or
parser-level (which we don't, quite yet)? We are in a state of flux, and I
think you are completely correct to say we need interop, but the problem in
the past has been that the public version of the DTD either didn't work (now
long since fixed) or was otherwise flawed (P, LI empty, etc). (I'm as much to
blame as anyone: I've just bodged my HTML+ because I think the idea of making
LI contain only P instead of %text; is overly restrictive, and I'm playing 
around with alternatives.) Interop: freeze HTML1/2 asap.

> Dan has tried to show how we can move to containers for P, DT, and
> still call it HTML.  Someone somewhere is wrong, as HoT MetaL
> WON'T READ HTML and WON'T WRITE HTML.

What does Yuri say?

> * If the scheme doesn't work in theory, we scrap the containers for HTML,
> and call everything with P as containers HTML+ which is incompatible,
> and define text/htmlplus.  That's fine... a single jump to get things clean.

But the CERN dtd defined P as - O last year...

///Peter