Re: simple HTML list considered harmful (Lou Montulli)
From: (Lou Montulli)
Message-id: <>
Subject: Re: simple HTML list considered harmful
Date: Wed, 29 Sep 93 11:39:56 CDT
In-reply-to: <>; from "Dave_Raggett" at Sep 29, 93 10:02 am
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL2]
> Some of your have mentioned the <BR> (line break) tag as a solution to
> Kevin's problem of how to layout postal addresses in a proportional font.
> Many people have suggested that <BR> isn't quite right during the WWW workshop
> and in subsequent discussions. Would anyone object to the proposal to replace
> it with the <L> tag which acts as a container for the following line, e.g.
> With slight simplifications, this would be defined by:
>         <!ELEMENT P - O (L+ | %text;)>
>         <!ATTLIST P id ID #IMPLIED>
>         <!ELEMENT L - O (%text;)>
>         <!ATTLIST L id ID #IMPLIED>
> e.g. for Kevin's purpose:
>         <P>
>         <L>First Last
>         <L>Address line 1
>         <L>Address line 2
>         <L>City, State, Zip
>         <L>Phone
>         <L>Fax
>         <L>email
> <L> is cleaner than <BR> since:
>     a)  Each line of text is contained by the preceding <L>
>         whereas <BR> acted as a line separator. Thus <P> and <L>
>         use the same model and are a better fit with SGML practice
>     b)  <L> allows you to identify each line explicitly, e.g. for
>         hypertext links or other cross references
> I will have the new draft for HTML+ as a discussion paper within a few days,
> and would very much like peoples views and suggestions on this and other
> topics.
Ok, lets see if I understand this correctly.  Someone asks me how to
get a linebreak in the middle of a paragraph without puting in an
extra space.  So I tell them to put in two <L>'s, one at the
beginning of the paragraph and one at the point of break:

   <l>This is an example paragraph. This is an example paragraph.
   This is an example paragraph. This is an example paragraph.
   This is an example paragraph. This is an example paragraph.
   I want a break after this line.
   <l>There was a break right before this line.  This has been
   an example paragraph.</para>

If I was a normal user (at times I consider myself normal), I would
find this completely insane.  When I want to do a linebreak I put
in a linebreak tag, it should be as simple as that.  

Many of you will say that this won't matter once we have WYSIWYG editors,
but 'I don't see no editors', and I have the feeling I never will.

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